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Frédéric Taddeï défend la liberté d'expression (suite)

J'ai publié sur Agoravox le billet précédent. Et le débat dans les commentaires m'a amené à approfondir, voici donc la suite...

Commentaire de Surya

Personnellement je trouve que le problème est super compliqué. Frédéric Taddei a, sur le principe, entièrement raison de ne vouloir aucune liste noire, aucune personne qu’il refuse d’inviter « parce qu’il ne l’aime pas », et je trouve également qu’il a raison lorsqu’il souhaite montrer, en tant qu’animateur de débat sur le service public, sa complète neutralité. Il est là pour animer, pas pour juger ou censurer. Tant qu’il invite sur son plateau à la fois une personne jugée subversive, mais aussi le contradicteur de cette personne, il n’y a rien à redire, le débat sera équilibré.
Jusque là, tout va bien...

Cependant, Taddéi le dit lui même, il n’invitera jamais personne dont les opinions sont « interdites par la loi ». Et c’est là, à mon avis, que ça ne colle plus : c’est quoi, une opinion « interdite par la loi » ?? D’abord, si la liberté d’expression et d’opinion est garantie par la déclaration des droits de l’homme, il ne devrait pas y avoir d’opinions « interdites par la loi ». C’est contradictoire. Autrement dit, l’Etat nous somme de penser ceci plutôt que cela, et finalement cet Etat ne fait rien d’autre que ce que Patrick Cohen fait lui même : refuser certaines opinions qu’il juge subversives, et refuser de les diffuser en donnant la parole à ceux qui les défendent.

Deuxièmement, si demain ce même état est dirigé par des gens un peu bizarres qui décident qu’il est autorisé par la loi de penser que les chambres à gaz n’ont jamais existé, que la pédophilie n’est pas un crime, que certaines races sont supérieures à d’autres, ou que sais-je... dans ce cas, Frédéric Taddéi va-t-il inviter sur son plateau les défenseurs de ces idées ? Sous prétexte qu’il ne fait rien de répréhensible, et que par conséquent il n’y aura jamais de plaintes sur « Ce Soir ou Jamais », puisque c’est autorisé par la loi ? Jusqu’où peut aller la neutralité ? Peut-on réellement blâmer Patrick Cohen ? N’a-t-il pas un peu raison aussi de vouloir être fidèle à ses propres convictions ? De ne pas vouloir cautionner, si toutefois donner la parole à quelqu’un, c’est cautionner sa pensée, des opinions qu’il juge dangereuses ?

Je trouve que dans ce court débat hyper intéressant, Frédéric Taddéi a raison sur le principe, mais il ne va pas assez loin lorsqu’il annonce tout à fait naturellement que les opinions qui sont exprimées sur son plateau sont « autorisées par la loi ». Il semble de plus se cacher un peu derrière cela pour sa conscience. « Tout ce qui n’est pas interdit est autorisé », dit-il.

En bref, j’approuve l’attitude de Taddéi, mais d’un autre côté je me demande jusqu’où sa neutralité pourrait aller si demain les opinions interdites devenaient autorisées. Continuerait-il à inviter tout le monde qui n’enfreint pas la loi, devenant de ce fait un bon petit soldat du service public, ou serait-il heurté au point qu’il déciderait de résister et prendre parti ?

D’une certaine façon, je trouve donc Patrick Cohen plus libre que Frédéric Taddéi. Même si l’on est en désaccord complet avec lui, ce qui est tout à fait compréhensible, je pense que son attitude est tout à fait défendable. Certes il ne fait pas preuve de neutralité, certes il n’est pas un défenseur de la liberté d’expression universelle, mais il a décidé de militer, et non juste d’animer, après tout c’est son droit, son opinion est autorisée par la loi, et de toute façon l’Etat, qui autorise ou interdit certaines opinions, n’est pas plus neutre que lui.

Autrement dit, quand c’est l’Etat qui interdit un truc, tout va bien, quand c’est un journaliste qui refuse d’inviter sur son plateau telle ou telle personne, tout d’un coup ça ne va plus, c’est une atteinte scandaleuse à la liberté d’expression ?

Réponse de ma part

Merci pour votre message, qui est intéressant et donne envie de débattre.

Pour moi, la complexité que cette question revêt pour vous tient au fait que nous mélangeons souvent deux choses : donner la parole à quelqu’un et approuver son point de vue. Or les deux choses sont bien différentes.

Vous connaissez la phrase de Voltaire : « Je déteste vos idées, mais je suis prêt à mourir pour votre droit de les exprimer ». La liberté d’expression pour les idées avec lesquelles on est d’accord, c’est facile. Et ça n’est pas la liberté d’expression, à l’évidence. La vraie liberté d’expression c’est celle que l’on reconnait à ses adversaires, aux idées que l’on aime pas, par définition !

C’est ce que Taddeï défend, tout en se soumettant aux lois françaises qui interdisent de tenir certains propos, à commencer par dire que les camps nazis n’ont pas existé. Taddeï ne dit pas ce qu’il pense de cette loi, il dit qu’il s’y soumet.

Je suis d’accord avec vous, l’Etat ne me semble pas plus légitime qu’un journaliste pour dicter ce qui est vrai ou faux, ce que l’on a le droit de dire ou non. La France n’est pas du tout un pays exemplaire sur ce point. Donc oui, pour moi il faudrait sans l’ombre d’un doute abolir toutes ces lois qui dictent l’Histoire. Et cela pour plusieurs raisons :

1/ La liberté d’expression est un droit qui doit être sacré, car il est un pivot de toutes nos libertés
2/ Il est plus efficace et plus sain de contredire une théorie, avec des arguments, que d’interdire son expression
3/ Cette interdiction renforce la sensation de victimisation, donne une aura, un crédit : si l’on me muselle c’est bien qu’il y a quelque chose à cacher. Et surtout, on sait bien que réprimer et refouler une expression, qu’elle soit individuelle ou collective, ne suffit pas à la faire disparaitre. Cela suffit à la cacher, et à la laisser proliférer dans l’ombre, dans l’inconscience (collective ou individuelle). Si l’on veut lutter contre des idées, le SEUL moyen est de le faire par la conscience, c’est à dire en apportant les ingrédients qui vont aider à comprendre. Ce n’est pas facile mais c’est la seule façon de faire. Sans oublier que derrière les pensées des uns et des autres se nichent leurs émotions, qui sont irrationnelles, et qui déterminent secrètement les pensées. Il ne faut pas non plus se masquer cela... On pourrait continuer ainsi de plonger vers la cause, et ce serait intéressant, mais un peu trop loin du sujet de départ peut-être... En résumé, autoriser toutes les expression, mais informer et contre-informer honnêtement est à mon avis une sortie par le haut, une attitude digne. Cacher, interdire me semble une solution de facilité, aux effets immédiats cosmétiques mais contre-productive en réalité, une solution lâche ou manipulatrice tout simplement.

Je suis d’accord avec Noam Chomsky qui dit que la seule restriction à la liberté d’expression admise devrait être la situation (ou équivalent) où un individu tient une arme dans sa main, pointée vers une potentielle victime. Il est interdit de lui dire « tire ». A part cela...

Commentaire de vfcc

@ l’auteur de l’article :

Vous indiquez que le pouvoir (Etat ou propriétaire de journal, annonceurs, ...) « contrôle » indirectement l’information.

Je me pose en contradicteur (mais merci de ne pas considérer que c’est ce que je pense)

Et vous demande pourquoi une émission comme « Ce soir ou Jamais » existe et perdure depuis des années ?
Cela ne vous semble pas en contradiction avec un pouvoir qui contrôlerait l’information ?

Réponse de ma part

En dictature aucun débordement n’est toléré hors de la doxa. C’est comme une cocotte minute, le peuple est sous pression, l’omerta et la peur maintiennent l’ordre en place. Une petite fissure risque à tout moment de se transformer en fuite irréparable. L’ordre est strict.

Dans nos démocraties contemporaines, le peuple est plutôt anesthésié (par la possession et le confort, par les produits chimiques qu’il ingère, par la télévision, par son travail, par la routine...). Même si la colère et l’injustice résident au fond de lui une épaisse couche de graisse maintient ces émotions.

A partir de là, l’expression d’une opinion dissidente est moins dangereuse. Ce qui compte c’est le dosage : il ne faut pas que trop d’individus se manifestent ensemble et puissent entraîner la masse. Ce qui est génial, c’est que cette gestion se fait de façon presque automatique, il est rare que le pouvoir intervienne lui-même.

Ceux qui le servent sont automatiquement bien servis par la machine, et plus ils sont influents plus ils sont à l’aise (patrons de syndicats, éditorialistes, producteurs...). La machine aime à entendre le doux ronron de sa propre opinion. Elle s’auto-félicite, elle aime à s’adorer dans le miroir de ses pairs. C’est un piège d’ego et d’orgueil, qui sert le pouvoir.

Ceux qui contestent auront le traitement inverse. Tout sera difficile. La moindre de leurs affirmations demandera des preuves d’une profondeur et d’une solidité que l’on exige jamais de leurs contradicteurs. Le moindre fait sera décortiqué, la moindre faille considérée comme la preuve d’une manipulation, la défiance sera permanente. Si, malgré cette différence de traitement, le dissident parvient à prouver indiscutablement ses assertions, il subira en général l’ostracisme, la calomnie, la caricature et l’éviction. Sa vie ne sera pas confortable.

Ces conditions générales limitent naturellement le nombre d’opinions dissidentes capables d’atteindre significativement le grand public, et cela sans que le pouvoir ait eu besoin de lever le petit doigt. C’est furtif et génial.

Il est donc possible de tolérer certains programmes un peu « border-line ». Cela comporte plusieurs avantages :

  • Ils servent de repoussoir et réconfortent les bien-pensants qui voient là le contrepoint de leur intelligence. C’est bien connu, l’ennemi soude les troupes.
  • Ils permettent de dire : vous voyez qu’on est des démocrates (votre argument)

Mais il existe tout de même une ligne rouge, invisible. Celui qui la franchit aura « dérapé » et perdra instantanément toute crédibilité, sans étude rationnelle de ses arguments. Cette ligne est constituée par la limite de ce que s’autorise à penser le monde médiatique mainstream, mais aussi la population dans sa majorité. Elle est aussi défendue discrètement par le pouvoir qui peut attaquer de façon très virulente et sans aucune considération du droit, certains individus précis.

On peur remarquer cependant que les émissions border-line sont régulièrement sabrées au pic de leur audience : Culture Pub ; Là-Bas si j’y suis relégué de 17h à 15h, heure de moindre écoute ; Lundi investigation (C+) policé et Paul Moreira ejecté ; Arrêt sur Images nettoyé avec Paul Amar placé en ersatz. De même Ardisson a été obligé de s’excuser publiquement après avoir popularisée l’ouvrage de Thierry Meyssan sur le 11 septembre etc.

Les individus eux aussi sont menacés dès lors que leur audience devient un peu étendue.

C’est comme s’il y avait une sorte de loi transgression/audience. Plus les propos que vous diffusez vont loin dans leur contenu moins on vous autorise une audience importante et vice-versa. Si le magazine Nexus, ou la Radio ici et Maintenant avaient l’audience de Ce soir ou jamais, je doute qu’ils eussent pu se maintenir aussi longtemps...

Quand quelque chose commence à marcher, que ça commence à se savoir, la rétroaction du milieu des médias ne fonctionne pas toujours, car l'audience est l'un de ses ressors les plus puissants. Là le pouvoir doit agir. C’est assez rare au final.

On peut remarquer que le même système est à l’œuvre un cran au dessus, au plan international, sous l’autorité des Etats-Unis. Lisez John Perkins pour les détails concrets. Notre pays doit subir de son supérieur, pour l’intérêt de ce dernier, la même pression qu’il met lui-même sur ses subordonnés, cette fois-ci pour son propre intérêt. Vous voyez l’imbrication ? C’est une structure fractale, holographique.

Nous avons des systèmes imbriqués de contrôle automatisé. A chaque échelle le pouvoir n’agit qu’à la marge, lorsqu’un débordement menace de se produire. Il fait de la correction d’erreurs... Sinon le mécanisme avance tout seul.

A quoi cela fait-il penser ? A une automobile. A la réplication de l’ADN. A un flux de données informatiques...

Notre façon de vivre collectivement ; notre façon de comprendre et d’interpréter le monde ; notre manière de façonner la matière ; répondent exactement au même schéma. On pourrait même parier que ce shéma se retrouve dans nos psychologies, dans notre intimité.

Cela invite à pousser plus loin la réflexion n’est-ce pas ?


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Strict Standards: Non-static method dt::_callback() should not be called statically in /home/gillesbe/www/ramassi/dotclear/inc/libs/lib.date.php on line 35

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Strict Standards: Non-static method dt::_callback() should not be called statically in /home/gillesbe/www/ramassi/dotclear/inc/libs/lib.date.php on line 35

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Strict Standards: Non-static method dt::_callback() should not be called statically in /home/gillesbe/www/ramassi/dotclear/inc/libs/lib.date.php on line 35

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Strict Standards: Non-static method dt::_callback() should not be called statically in /home/gillesbe/www/ramassi/dotclear/inc/libs/lib.date.php on line 35

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Strict Standards: Non-static method dt::_callback() should not be called statically in /home/gillesbe/www/ramassi/dotclear/inc/libs/lib.date.php on line 35

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Strict Standards: Non-static method dt::_callback() should not be called statically in /home/gillesbe/www/ramassi/dotclear/inc/libs/lib.date.php on line 35

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Strict Standards: Non-static method dt::_callback() should not be called statically in /home/gillesbe/www/ramassi/dotclear/inc/libs/lib.date.php on line 35

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Strict Standards: Non-static method dt::_callback() should not be called statically in /home/gillesbe/www/ramassi/dotclear/inc/libs/lib.date.php on line 35

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Strict Standards: Non-static method dt::_callback() should not be called statically in /home/gillesbe/www/ramassi/dotclear/inc/libs/lib.date.php on line 35

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Strict Standards: Non-static method dt::_callback() should not be called statically in /home/gillesbe/www/ramassi/dotclear/inc/libs/lib.date.php on line 35

Calendrier


Deprecated: Non-static method util::getNextPrev() should not be called statically, assuming $this from incompatible context in /home/gillesbe/www/ramassi/dotclear/layout/class.xblog.php on line 110

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